How did you deal with MATHCOUNTS disappointments?

[mathlearner]

yet (without seeing the actual stats - which might tell a whole 'nother story!) it still seems odd to me - seeing how targets are generally harder than sprints (hence why more time is allowed to complete each one on average) -- it seems odd to me how a nats participant - (or a bunch of nats participants?) who clearly have a certain level of skill to even BE at nats, well it seems odd how they could get ALL targets right and still have so many Sprints wrong as to not make it into the top 12 ... I can see getting a few Sprints wrong -- but a perfect target with more than 8 sprints wrong - does anyone else think that is somewhat unusual?? And what might be the explanation for it?

[JBoyd]

The coaches get statistics that they can look at that tell them how many got perfect sprints, targets or teams but they do not get a comparison. They do not know which targets belong to which sprints other than their own students. Usually there are several kids that get perfect on targets (not so many at nationals. I think that is because they have a calculator in their hands. I have noticed that on a lot of Mathcounts competititons, especially with the younger kids (6th or 7th graders). A lot of times they know the method to use but they might not be able to handle the mathematics, With a calculator the math is not a problem. It eliminates the careless micky mouse dum-dum.

In the sprint round if you make a carless arithmatic mistake you might not catch it since you usuallu do not have the time to check all your problems. On the target and with the calculator you have the time to check your work.

[PowerOfPi]

This is getting off topic, but the Sprint is a little easier and you make stupid mistakes on easier problems.

[mathlearner]

PowerofPi - I think you make an excellent and valid point, and one that is sort of topic related in a way. I think that my own disappointment and the disappointment of the person I'm close to who was really devastated by this year's outcome at Nats had to do with JUST what you had said. In that, they nailed the targets but just couldn't (and still have a hard time) quite comprehending how they can do SO well on Target, USAMO, and even ARML problems, but get about a third of the questions wrong on an "easier" Sprint round - especially a round many people say they felt was relatively easy this year (note - "ease" is largely opinion - though one can argue that, I guess).

I also wonder if making "careless errors" or in some cases, "overcomplicating" the problem, and thus making more mistakes on "easy ones" while acing the more diffficult ones, causes the MATHCOUNTS Competition as a whole to sort of "handicap" or "penalize" the more advanced students and allows some participants to make the top 12 who by more difficult tests would NOT have made it, and results in others NOT making the top 12 (or ranking not as high as their skills would lead one to believe) by virtue of careless errors they wouldn't typically make on more advanced problems. (one only needs to review this year's National rankings to support such a conclusion, which by no means applies to all participants) I guess I agree with Coach Boyd in that I'd prefer more difficult tests (at all levels) to separate "the men from the boys" so to speak. (Note - that's my quote - not Coach Boyd's - but, Coach Boyd, I believe you posted about preferring more difficult questions.)

[Mewto55555]

[math154]

You usually have over 1 second though. Plus the more tedious stuff=computer bash.

[mathlearner]

I think the flaw in Mewto55555's analogy is that as math154 said, you'd have more time -- and if building a bridge that was to be used by people, cars, etc., I think the engineer would (hopefully) have ample time to check - and Recheck - and likely check AGAIN before actual use -- and in this case, I would take an engineer capable of building much more intricate or difficult bridges (and who IS likely to catch careless errors just as most nats competitors would do given just a bit more time) than someone capable of building only less complex models.

Just as I'd prefer a surgeon capable of doing more difficult surgeries operating on me for a minor one (figuring if something went wrong, they'd know how to correct on the spot.) -- (of course, I'd hope neither surgeon made "careless errrors"!! )

[CEM_College_Champ]

Would doing trigonometry, calculus (whether SV or MV is not important) or complex-valued functions be of any help in Mathcounts preparation?

[james4l]

Very unlikely, as while they can be applicable strategies for solving MC problems there are generally MUCH easier methods of solution.

Case in point, this problem:

A triangle, with a 30 degree angle, side length 5 opposite of the angle, and another side length 7, find the sum of all possible values for the third side.

Trigbash definitely worked, but there was a (much!) more elegant solution.

[myyellowducky82]

[PowerOfPi]

As Mewto55555 said somewhere:

I managed to forget the forumla for the volume of a sphere and rederived it using calculus. (that isn't an exact quote, so I am not going to put quotation marks around it)

[algebra1337]

well, in response to the actual question of the topic, even though its kinda late, i thought that i would just study a lot harder next year.

[PowerOfPi]

But some for some people, that was their last chance. I would just say, try to forget about it. The point of MathCounts is having fun, meeting other people interested in math, and building team skills, not getting first place.

EDIT: I edited it, and added what JBoyd added.

[JBoyd]

I don't think the point of Mathcounts is just to have fun. It is to learn something and hopefully open some of the doors to future learnings in mathematics and to have some fun along the way. You will learn work ethic and how to work as a member of the team. You will learn that you can accomplish a lot more as a team than you can all by yourself. Those skills will be useful for the rest of your life in just about everything that you will do.

[mathlearner]

Mmm... with all due respect - a lot of respect - for Coach Boyd and Coach Boyd's opinion (as posted above this one) - I don't believe MATHCOUNTS is just about "team building" and in fact, I know of number of participants at Nats - several who were even in the top 10%, who made it to Nats STRICTLY as individuals for reasons ranging from that they came from a school with no team, and worse, no interest to start a team!, and/or homeschoolers who again, had no team, and in fact, these are some of the most motivated, self-starting people you'll ever meet - having had the motivation, drive, innate abilities, and sheer determination to succeed without the extreme benefit of having a coach like Coach Boyd (or any coach, in many cases), without having many, or any, MATHCOUNTS practice materials except what they could scrounge on the net and/or afford to purchase (and most Nats tests weren't available in the past) so I guess what I'm saying is perhaps MATHCOUNTS offers different benefits for different people. In some cases, fun IS the biggest benefit, in some cases team-building, and yes, in some cases, just the sheer desire to be the best and to at least have a GOAL of being #1 or in the top 12 or top 57 or whatever someone's goal is, is the main reason for participation. However, I think some angst arises for middle-schoolers if/when their goals are not met, and thus, in some cases, maybe the biggest benefit is as this post asks - how they ultimately learn to deal with such disappointment.

[PowerOfPi]

I didn't know much about MathCounts and I thought the top 8 advance from state, and that was my goal. I got fifth, partially acheiving my goal. I got top 8, but didn't advance. The top 8 went to countdown.

[Mewto55555]

Well trig sometimes helps, but I wouldn't recommend learning it if you are weak in other areas. You should patch those up first.

Case in point: #20-something(27?) on this years sprint was like there is a 15-75-90 triangle with sidelength something opposite the something angle. What is the area? You could split the 75 degree angle into a 45 and 30 and go from there, or remember what sin75 and sin15 are. I did the latter and finished pretty quickly.

[Gears]

...nikeballa96...

how do u think i feel...

76 @ nats!

at least u made top 57...

[BOGTRO]

It happens. The point of mathcounts is to have fun, so if you had fun, there isn't really a problem.

Just work more and try again next year. If this was your last year, move on. Things happen in life. The trick is to come back as if they were nothing.

[vallon22]

as Mr VD once said at one of my school assemblies: